Be Careful With What You Call Coonery

gina says:

I don’t watch BET, but the existence of shows like this would be easier to stomach if there was more range in the portrayal of black women on TV. Apparently all we are shown as is “loud, country, emotional, and dramatic.” According to TV and movies, there are no shy, bookish, urbane, quiet, or reserved black women. They simply don’t exist.

I think the name-calling is a wrong-headed attempt to differentiate between the reality – that black behavior (like any other group’s behavior) cannot be pigeonholed – and shame at the stereotypical, manufactured portrayal.

kweeen says:

i do think that these shows reflect images that we are afraid or refuse to acknowledge about ourselves. we never truly see how our actions and decisions might affect someone or even ourselves in the short or long run. i find it sad that people nowadays must put everything in a category in order to accept it. EVERYBODY have their own ways to deal with the ‘troubles of the world’. these women might be seen as ‘ghetto’ because they express themselves ‘loudly’ and ‘air out their dirty laundry’ but there are sooooo many people who hide and do things behind other people’s backs and feel justified in their actions; is that any better?? i haven’t watched the show and probably won’t, but it’s time we stop judging people for having THEIR own way of dealing with their troubles. if u don’t like it, umm, change the channel or walk away. DUH!

ceecee says:

@ Gina I think that we can find good examples if we look, yes you may have to look a little harder but they are there. I just watched Antwone Fisher and Joy Bryant played an amazing part. Sanaa Lathan played the role of “shy, bookish, urbane, quiet, or reserved black women” in Something New. There’s Love Jones, The Best Man, to name a few.

Chanel says:

Okay so i’m guilty of straddling the fence here.I talk mad shit about Tiny, Toya, Neffie & dem…but im addicted to it like it’s crack, thus im part of the problem of the high ratings for such shows. For me, they’re entertainment, pure & simple. I dnt know anyone in similar predicaments to any of them but I do know it exists and if these shows can persuade others to get up and do MORE with themselves, more power to them. I just feel like BET does so very little to show black women in a positive light and watchng Frankie yell HOLLA while flyin off into her rages as Neffie struggles with the decision to abort or not abort her child…smh. No. Its a mess.

Met says:

“Regardless of the fact that these women may be loud, “country”, emotional, and dramatic I see the beauty in their struggles.”

The problem, as I see it, is that they are being used to perpetuate negative stereotypes about black women. They most likely have gone through some hardships in their lives, everyone has. I don’t see having hardships as a justification for acting ghetto or knowingly acting in a way validates negative images of Black females; it their actions and puts their behavior/thought process in context.

As for them being on TV, I more pissed with the channels that green lit these types of shows than I am the actual Tiny, Frankie, and the rest of the women. It is not the hard to find living, breathing, positive examples of black females (or males).

thinkpink says:

I’m interested in the comment left by J.G. “Sorry but I don’t know women like these, and I’m certainly not related to any, if I were, we couldn’t be friends. Birds of a feather…”

What exactly is meant by the comment women like “these”? If you haven’t watched the show how could you know what kind of women they are? Unless your basing your opinion on the photo attached to the article. When I first saw previews for the Tiny and Toya show I thought it would be another negative depiction of our race. However after watching the show i too became hooked. It made me see them as strong women who have endured a lot in their lives and still strive to prosper in spite of their circumstance.

I too was an individual that thought I was above socializing with women like Tiny and Toya. They were too loud, too ghetto, didn’t speak properly, didn’t dress professionally and lacked education. After watching the show i’ve begun to check my snooty attitude at the door. I’ve been very blessed in my upbringing but forgot that some people don’t have it so easy. This showed me another side of life. We don’t all live in Baldwin Hills, Harlem Heights. The reality of our culture isn’t always shiny, or pretty. This is the first reality show to deal with that truth.

Donna says:

I was surprised that I liked the Tiny and Toya show which made me take a look at The Way it Is. It’s sad much of the lives but I like them both because neither (from what I’ve seen thus far) is elevating the things they’ve gone through. You actually see the pain that comes out of the tragedies and in both cases the “stronger” individual in the fam loving their family enough to move them to a better environment. Then Neffe being one to say I’m not going to lay on my sister and I have to have my own.

I tend to be bitter towards these type of shows because I too have fam like this but they never wanted to better themselves and being that I’d experienced some of the same, it can become hard to relate to I been through abc xyz because you can over come it.

But again I’m happy I watched both of these shows because they are working on making changes and also just the human aspect to it all.

Crys Mack says:

Glennisha, Great article….great topic…Look at all the feedback! Congrats!

That said:
I could givce two Sniffs about what WHITE people think of US. However,I am very concerned with how we view OURSELVES. Since I havn’t seen either show, I can’t speak to the content. I will ask this though: What message do these shows send to black women and girls? Only those who watch can answer.

I completely agree with Noni and Shadow. Where is the diversity in representing Black Women? Pearl Cleage called it twenty years ago…. sexually loose Jezebel, long suffering, desexualized Mamie, ghetto, loud, Welfare Mamma, and self sacraficing Auntie…that’s it. GIRLFRIENDS may have been the first diviation from these images.

And as far as the beautiful struggles of black women, there are those who have done it with FAR FEWER means than the wives and families of grammy award winning artists. And with much more grace/class to boot.

I DO know that I saw Frankie at the airport and was able to observe for about twenty minutes. SHE IS A TORNADO! And not in a good way. Every thing and everyone around her was in turmoil. HER BEHAVIOR and language was embarrassing. If she is anything like that on TV…I won’t be watching Frankie and Neffie anytime soon.

peace

shelton says:

My issue is that we have come so far as a race of people and when I constantly see shows that depict us as loud or even foolish it saddens me to no end. I mean there are black people that are positive and hard working and raising kings and queens out here. There is a high demand for foolishness and i for one dont watch these shows because it does not reflect what we as a people are about. Sure that is one side but when Tiny and Toya get more ratings than CNN black in America then you tell me where we are headed as a people. We have to wake up and reach one teach one.

atlpeach says:

Without watching Tiny and Toya, it’s easy to assume the show is stereotypcial. Two “baby mamas” who have a country accent and it’s on BET. But I have a feeling people stopped there and started making assumptions about the show’s content before viewing the program.

I saw the first show, and was forced to come to terms with the misconceptions I and other black people have accepted about other blacks we deem “hood.”

The fact of the matter is, as Black folks we have also internalized ideas that certain things that seem “too Black” are somehow inferior. From what I actually saw, I found the show to be one of the most real, compassionate reality shows I have seen, black or white. Comparing this to shows like the Hills or Real World, where cast members are often vapid and shallow, Tiny and Toya prove to be class acts with heart and soul.

On the sneak peak, Toya was dealing with the heartbreak of rescuing her mother from drug abuse while Tiny was struggling with her father’s Alzheimer’s. It was sad, real, and showed a vulnerable side to the ladies that you don’t have an opportunity to see in other shows. Tiny also reminded the audience that while yes, she’s the mother of T.I.’s kids, they met when Tiny was at the peak of her success with Xscape and he was still underground trying to get some radio play. She was not some gold-digging groupie.

Weaves and accents aside (which a lot of us Black women have, so let’s not be so damn uppity) Tiny and Toya were likeable and the show was better than all that other mess we don’t criticize.

Vio says:

I love this article G. I also love your questions. Whats funny is the same people who call Tiny and Toya ‘ghetto’ are JUST AS ‘ghetto.’ Now we have to then think about how we perceive words like ghetto–i really dont have a definition b/c i see as nuances of your upbringing, the colloquialisms you use, etc. And these are things that I have learned to EMBRACE! i mean I’m not tryna walk around loud or nothing all the time. Man, my mind can take this in multiple places–let’s define ghetto as being ‘thinking and actions that you carry from your hood.’ <–basic and not the best definition. So what people do is put down what is ‘ghetto’ to make themselves feel better even if they are living in the heart of it or around the corner from it. Im learning it’s certain things from the hood (defining all of detroit as the hood lol) that I need, that I want but there are some things that i can do away with it b/c i don’t find them healthy for me…

grrr i wanna keep this concise.

One thing I don’t like is them being looked at negatively b/c of their accents. We in the north, especially place like Michigan can be as country as they come because of our roots. If we go to the West coast people will call us country. But it’s this degree–I’m not AS *blank* as them. And so being country is sometimes equated to not being smart, so connect ‘country’ to ‘not being smart’ to ‘ghetto’, you have a formula that everyone thinks they can tear a part. But it’s a stereotype and ridiculous and just another way for us to divide and put down others b/c of their own ignorance. Know what i mean? There is an accent hierarchy in this country, a right way to speak english measured against Standard American English and it’s so wack.

idk, this is too long. but people need to grow up. maybe im biased b/c i like tiny and toya so thats why im going so hard, but really people are judging people who mirror them in some way.

gosh this is too long! ok thats it for now

anonygrl says:

@Mariah: I get so sick of people like you. I understand there are huge differences between black americans and african black people, but by making ignorant, smug comments like yours you are doing nothing but furthering the divide. i am sure you know this, and that you don’t care, ma’am.

Mariah says:

Yes, eloquent indeed. In any case, you don’t offer any alternative to what I said. What was smug? Saying that my parents are educated? Saying that not ALL blacks have relatives like that? The article above put black people in a box. I simply let my opinion be known that no, not all blacks are like that or have relatives like that. Be specific if you are going to judge my comment.

Now, what I HATE are people that roll their eyes and ignore the FACT that there is a significant gap between black Americans and other blacks, specifically those from Africa. My comment did nothing to alter that gap. It is no bigger or smaller than before I left that comment. We don’t even have to go to the Mother Land to see the divide. Look at how Rhianna was thrown under the bus by black women! Many of whom repeated tired, ridiculous, stereotypes of the “loud, aggressive, Caribbean ” girl.

I’ve said my piece.

anonygrl says:

@ceecee: thank you!